Radio Interview - ABC Radio Melbourne, Drive with Ali Moore

E&OE TRANSCRIPT 
ABC RADIO MELBOURNE 
DRIVE WITH ALI MOORE 
MONDAY, 2 DECEMBER 2024

SUBJECT: Government Response to the Royal Commission into Defence and Veteran Suicide.

ALI MOORE, HOST: Matt Keogh is the Minister for Veterans' Affairs. Minister, welcome to Drive.

MINISTER FOR VETERANS’ AFFAIRS AND DEFENCE PERSONNEL, MATT KEOGH: Hi, Ali, great to be with you.

MOORE: A Government response after three months. Is that some sort of a record for a response to a Royal Commission?

MINISTER KEOGH: Look, Ali, I haven't gone back to check the early period of Federation, but it's probably right up there if it's not.

MOORE: If we can look then at the recommendations that you have supported. As I said, that is most of them. What do you see among them as being the most challenging for Defence to implement?

MINISTER KEOGH: Well, I think one of the most important, and I'll just start there, is this setting up of a Defence and Veterans’ Service Commission which will be the statutory oversight body. And we're getting that up and running now because we recognise the importance of that and the advice that it will be able to provide to governments into the future on an ongoing basis. I think one of the key things, though is also going to be setting up this wellbeing agency within the Department of Veterans’ Affairs. Because for a long time we've had feedback that there was a view that the Department of Veterans’ Affairs needed to be more holistic in its approach to supporting our veterans and families community and having this agency set up within the Department to focus on those wellbeing issues for our veterans and families community. I think will go a long way to meeting that need and addressing the core issues that have been raised by the Royal Commission. But it also represents a step change in the work that the Department of Veterans’ Affairs does and so with that comes a degree of difficulty, but it's important work and so we are doing it.

MOORE: It's difficult though, isn't it? Because fundamentally you're training people to ultimately, if necessary, kill people and then we're worried about their wellbeing.

MINISTER KEOGH: Well, I think it's important to recognise that nothing about the recommendations and our response detract from capability. Obviously, maintaining our military capability is incredibly important, but also we don't have a Defence Force of robots. We have a Defence Force of people and they are our most important capability because none of the other equipment or anything else works without them and we put them in very difficult circumstances. And if we don't have a Defence Force that operates in a way that recognises that they are people, both when they're on the front line and after they've gone through any issues that they may confront and properly supports them in that, then we're not going to be able to achieve the very necessary recommendations that have been set out and the response that we have put out today. So, we recognise that our people are our most important capability and they need to be supported as people and they are people that put our our uniform and sometimes make the supreme sacrifice for our nation and we need to support them and their families.

MOORE: The new Defence and Veterans’ Service Commission that you just talked about, that will have, as I understand it, a sort of oversight role, is that correct? And who will sit on that Commission? Will it include civilians?

MINISTER KEOGH: The oversight body, the Defence and Veterans’ Service Commission, is certainly going to be people that understand the impact of service life on our veterans and families, but it is going to be independent from Defence and DVA. That's incredibly important.

MOORE: But who sits on it? Does that mean veterans only or does it mean civilians as too?

MINISTER KEOGH: No, the Commission itself, we’ll be making announcements around that soon. But what's important is that it's able to take that real world experience and understanding of lived experience of veterans and of families, and apply that in its understanding and review of how government is implementing the recommendations of the Royal Commission and its understanding of the research and work and any inquiries that it undertakes, and then can provide that advice to Government going forward. So, it's going to have, I think, importantly, a range of people working for it with all of that different experience and expertise coming together, and that's important.

MOORE: So, just to clarify, that range of people will include those from civilian walks of life as well as veterans.

MINISTER KEOGH: So, what we are saying, we'll announce who's going to be running that Commission soon, but the Commission needs to draw upon people that have lived experience in Defence, of being veterans, of families, but also those that can bring expertise to the table as well civilians, as you might describe them, but that are able to bring that cross section of information together through inquiries, through research to advise government on what we need to be doing going forward.

MOORE: I guess that's key because as you know better than most, I mean, there have been reviews and recommendations and commitments for decades into Defence. What makes you confident that this is going to be the one that is going to make the difference, that is going to change the culture?

MINISTER KEOGH: Well, that's absolutely right, Ali, that we've seen many, many inquiries over time and that's why the Royal Commission was so keen that its recommendation 122 it saw as one of the key recommendations that it was making to have a statutory oversight body. We accepted that early on and we've put some meat to the bone of that today in the announcement that we're setting up the Defence and Veterans’ Service Commission to do that work. And we'll be appointing an interim head for that so that it can start doing that work soon whilst we legislate to set it up as a statutory body next year. And it's that body that will be making sure and holding governments to account in implementing these recommendations, but also providing additional advice to government over time as we go forward, not just our government, future governments, about further changes or additional services or supports that are needed for our veteran and family community so we don't find ourselves in this place again.

MOORE: You're listening to Matt Keogh, who's the Minister for Veterans’ Affairs, also the Minister for Defence Personnel. Minister, just a couple of very specific things that came out of this and that you have, that you have agreed to. One is that military personnel found guilty of sexual offences will face mandatory expulsions. Does Defence accept that as a non-negotiable?

MINISTER KEOGH: Yes, we've agreed to that recommendation and that will happen.

MOORE: Are there limits to that? I mean, what's this? Will there be appeal processes? How will that work?

MINISTER KEOGH: So, it'll work through a similar process to where there is at the moment what we call a default disposition. So, where someone has been convicted of this sort of offence, then the default is well you're leaving. There's still a process where they can put their side of that argument. But I think we see where, I think everyone sees where anyone in those circumstances, where it's going. So, there is still a process and that's important and that's highlighted by the Royal Commission itself. They don't avoid that issue either, but making sure that this is a clear assumption that if you're convicted of an offence like this, then you will be departing the Defence Force. And I think it's important that we not only agree it and implement it, but that we talk about that, because it sends a very clear message through our Defence Force and to the community about how seriously we take this.

MOORE: The one recommendation that was rejected outright by the government was the one to remove the service differential. Now, as I understand it, it provides higher compensation payments for personnel who were permanently injured during war like service, compared to those who are permanently injured during training exercises. And there's been a differential for a long time. Why is it important that that is maintained?

MINISTER KEOGH: So, that differential, as it's called, where we pay a higher level of compensation for those that have seen operational service, those that have been in warlike, non-warlike conditions, as opposed to peacetime injuries, has been a feature of our veteran support ecosystem and legislation as it's evolved over time. It's been a feature for over 100 years and the veterans community is very committed to maintaining that. There are divergent views, but it is a very divisive issue across the veteran community, this one particular issue. And so we have determined to not make that particular change. That is part of one recommendation that we are not following.

MOORE: But why? I mean, just because something is divisive doesn't mean it's not worth pursuing.

MINISTER KEOGH: We recognise there are people who have called for that particular change and they've obviously given evidence to the Royal Commission and we understand the arguments that are put forward for making that change. We're not, you know, we understand the basis and the argument that sits behind that, but it is an issue that is very strongly felt in the veteran community and is a feature that has been part of our veterans support environment for over a century now. And we've decided to not make that particular change.

MOORE: Matt Keogh, thank you very much for joining us.

MINISTER KEOGH: Great to be with you.

MOORE: That's the Minister for Veterans' Affairs, Minister for Defence Personnel as well.

ENDS

Open Arms – Veterans & Families Counselling provides 24/7 free confidential crisis support for current and ex-serving ADF personnel and their families on 1800 011 046 or the Open Arms website. Safe Zone Support provides anonymous counselling on 1800 142 072. Defence All-Hours Support Line provides support for ADF personnel on 1800 628 036 or the Defence Health Portal. Defence Member and Family Helpline provides support for Defence families on 1800 624 608